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 Josh Gordon WR CLE

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Whiskey Creek Gadabouts
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Jul 30, 2014 3:36 pm

Chicago Crime Syndicate wrote:
Sanibel Gadabouts wrote:
Isn't it mandated though... It's like the minimum sentencing guidelines in federal court.. You can have all the extenuating circumstances you want, but if you're guilty of X, you're getting Y sentence.  

He's guilty of the positive test and the 2nd vial confirmed there was THC in his system.  Therefore, 16 games.

Yeah I know, which is why I doubt he gets off.  But I'll just throw it out there that minimum sentencing is just one of the reasons why out justice system fucking sucks.  I HATE minimum sentencing guidelines.  They make no fucking sense whatsoever.

Sentencing guidelines are moronic. I think this is an all or nothing proposition for Gordon. Either they waive the result entirely because of the sample "chance" or they tell him too bad.


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Minnesota Eternals
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Jul 30, 2014 3:47 pm

Devils Tower Outlaws wrote:
Minnesota Eternals wrote:
JosephO wrote:
I am a Browns fan.. We're going to the Superbowl up until Week 1.

 lol3 

Like Mike, I can't wait til we stop hearing about it.

Like Jon, I say up the suspension for the appeal.

I think the NFL should just roll with a "if you fuckin do anything stupid that negatively impacts the shield, your year is done" because for selfish reasons we could stop wasting time on the details of stupid peoples stupidity and focus on good people doing good things.

Ban them all and get people devoted to football.

Then we are right back to Ray Rice being suspended for the year at least...   Players who beat up their wives bring far more shame to the NFL than an immature who smokes weed....   And around and around we keep going!   Actually your rule would mean about half the players are suspended for the year,  every year...  which would just mean we would have a lot more of these bullshit stories to dissect ad nauseum...  

Actually,  the NFL should lighten up and go ahead and "legalize" testing positive for weed and worry about punishing people who have committed actual crimes...  

Not exactly. In my system there is nothing to discuss. No excuses, no appeals...nothing. Sure Ray would be out for the year but we already would have been talking about him weeks ago. I also wouldn't change the pot rule simply because I like it to test a guys commitment and as we can clearly see we would limit how many tards are in the league by keeping the rule as is. I would like to suspend half the players for one reason or another so thats no problem.

 hehe 


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Norfolk Bombers
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Jul 30, 2014 4:52 pm

What is so hard to get.  Are people not reading the entire case or what?

Gordon vs Rice -  Gordon is on his THIRD STRIKE.  It is not about what he did, it is about the fact he has messed up ALOT!  Stop this already...

Gordon's B sample was not "clean", it was 13.6 ng/ml.  The threshold is 15.  The rules agreed to under the CBA is that you test sample A.  If it is clean then you do not test sample B.  If it is not clean, then you test sample B for the appearance of the same thing.  Sample B does not have to meet the threshold it only has to have the substance present.  This is what happened.  They are not on shaky legal ground as this process was agreed to in the CBA. If the NFL holds him to the letter of the law we will find out Friday.  


This is not about banning someone for smoking pot, this is about an IDIOT who cannot follow rules that have been clearly laid out for him....


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Minnesota Eternals
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Jul 30, 2014 4:55 pm

Norfolk Bombers wrote:
What is so hard to get.  Are people not reading the entire case or what?

Gordon vs Rice -  Gordon is on his THIRD STRIKE.  It is not about what he did, it is about the fact he has messed up ALOT!  Stop this already...

Gordon's B sample was not "clean", it was 13.6 ng/ml.  The threshold is 15.  The rules agreed to under the CBA is that you test sample A.  If it is clean then you do not test sample B.  If it is not clean, then you test sample B for the appearance of the same thing.  Sample B does not have to meet the threshold it only has to have the substance present.  This is what happened.  They are not on shaky legal ground as this process was agreed to in the CBA. If the NFL holds him to the letter of the law we will find out Friday.  


This is not about banning someone for smoking pot, this is about an IDIOT who cannot follow rules that have been clearly laid out for him....


Ahhhh....a post like this makes me feel so refreshed and relaxed.  agreed 


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Naperville Divine
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Jul 30, 2014 6:00 pm

Great post. I am in another league and I have Gordon. I can pick 4 keepers. The deadline is August 1st. I have to make a decision on Gordon and I have decided to let him go. I cant wait to see the decision.


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Philadelphia Pigskins
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Jul 30, 2014 7:44 pm

Quote :
Josh Gordon's appeal will be "all or nothing," either resulting in no ban at all or a full-year suspension.
NFLPA spokesman Brian McCarthy confirmed to PFT that when the league's disciplinary penalties were established 20 years ago, "the union expressed the strong view that they needed to be stated and mandatory to ensure that all players be treated the same regardless of position, experience, level of ability, or competitive considerations." If the hearing officer determines the violation was "established," Gordon will be "bound" to the one-year suspension. In other words, Gordon's ban could not be reduced to six, eight, or ten games. If the hearing officer finds there was a violation of the league's drug policy, Gordon's one-year ban will stand. If no violation is established, Gordon will be free to play a 16-game schedule barring a short ban related to his July DUI arrest.


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Minnesota Eternals
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Jul 30, 2014 11:45 pm

I think in order to appeal you should have to have something to lose...be curious how smart an idea this would seem to him if next season hung in the balance if this was merely a waste of everyones time which of course we all know that it is.


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JosephO
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Thu Jul 31, 2014 6:03 am

I had him last year and traded him before week 1 thinking he'd be a bust. Boy was I soo wrong.


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Baja Beatniks
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Fri Aug 01, 2014 8:16 am

Please just let this chapter be over today. A final decision with no ability to appeal and a quick official announcement of that decision.


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Mohawk Ridge Marauders
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Fri Aug 01, 2014 8:38 am

Keep waiting:

Quote :
CLEVELAND, Ohio -- No decision is expected Friday on Josh Gordon's indefinite ban for violating the NFL's substance-abuse policy, and he'll be back in Cleveland by Saturday, league sources have told cleveland.com.

A decision is expected soon, but not immediately after Friday's appeal hearing at the NFL offices in New York City.

It's uncertain if Gordon will be back in time Saturday to participate in the Family Day scrimmage Saturday at the University of Akron, which begins at 11:30 a.m.

Gordon's attorneys, Heather McPhee of the NFLPA and Maurice Suh, will argue in front of arbitrator Harold Henderson that Gordon tested positive for marijuana because of second-hand smoke. They'll also state that the test results of his "A" and "B" specimens were inconsistent, and that Gordon should not be banished from the NFL based on those results.

Henderson can impose something less than the minimum one-year ban, but that rarely happens, because an "appeal ruling is expected to affirm or reject the decision,'' a league source said.

No NFL player is believed to have won an appeal on the grounds of second-hand smoke. However, Gordon's attorneys feel his case is different, because he's the only one in their research with a "B'' test -- the quality-control specimen used to confirm a positive "A'' test -- under the NFL threshold of 15 nanograms of the banned substance in marijuana per milliliter.

Former Giants and current Ravens defensive back Will Hill recently lost his appeal of a six-game suspension after blaming his positive test on second-hand smoke.

A source told cleveland.com that Henderson will take a hard-line stance on the passive smoke argument, and NFL spokesman Greg Aiello stressed that NFL players are responsible for what's in their bodies.

Even if Gordon wins his appeal, he could still be suspended or otherwise disciplined under the personal-conduct policy for his DWI last month in Raleigh, N.C. His hearing for that is Aug. 26.


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JosephO
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Fri Aug 01, 2014 8:59 am

I expect the worst. Full season.


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Baja Beatniks
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Fri Aug 01, 2014 9:30 am

Mohawk Ridge Marauders wrote:
Keep waiting:

Quote :
CLEVELAND, Ohio -- No decision is expected Friday on Josh Gordon's indefinite ban for violating the NFL's substance-abuse policy, and he'll be back in Cleveland by Saturday, league sources have told cleveland.com.

A decision is expected soon, but not immediately after Friday's appeal hearing at the NFL offices in New York City.

It's uncertain if Gordon will be back in time Saturday to participate in the Family Day scrimmage Saturday at the University of Akron, which begins at 11:30 a.m.

Gordon's attorneys, Heather McPhee of the NFLPA and Maurice Suh, will argue in front of arbitrator Harold Henderson that Gordon tested positive for marijuana because of second-hand smoke. They'll also state that the test results of his "A" and "B" specimens were inconsistent, and that Gordon should not be banished from the NFL based on those results.

Henderson can impose something less than the minimum one-year ban, but that rarely happens, because an "appeal ruling is expected to affirm or reject the decision,'' a league source said.

No NFL player is believed to have won an appeal on the grounds of second-hand smoke. However, Gordon's attorneys feel his case is different, because he's the only one in their research with a "B'' test -- the quality-control specimen used to confirm a positive "A'' test -- under the NFL threshold of 15 nanograms of the banned substance in marijuana per milliliter.

Former Giants and current Ravens defensive back Will Hill recently lost his appeal of a six-game suspension after blaming his positive test on second-hand smoke.

A source told cleveland.com that Henderson will take a hard-line stance on the passive smoke argument, and NFL spokesman Greg Aiello stressed that NFL players are responsible for what's in their bodies.

Even if Gordon wins his appeal, he could still be suspended or otherwise disciplined under the personal-conduct policy for his DWI last month in Raleigh, N.C. His hearing for that is Aug. 26.

Oh goddammit.


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Minnesota Eternals
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Fri Aug 01, 2014 10:32 am

I think a two season suspension is fair at this point. This is annoying.


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JosephO
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Fri Aug 01, 2014 2:59 pm

Minnesota Eternals wrote:
I think a two season suspension is fair at this point.  This is annoying.

2 seasons would be insanely unfair. I think 8 games would be fair followed by a season if he screws up again. At Browns training camp all the fans were signing a wall with #freegordon  pray 
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JosephO
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 11:41 am

So Josh Gordon suspension upheld. One year. And now Gordon will miss all of next year's training camp as well.

Fuck the NFL.


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Mohawk Ridge Marauders
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 11:42 am

Thank fucking god it's over. Oh and he'll miss more time next year after he gets his for the DUI.


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Mohawk Ridge Marauders
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 11:52 am

Here's the statement that the moron released:

Quote :
“I'd like to apologize to my teammates, coaches, the Cleveland Browns organization and our fans," Gordon said in a statement through the NFLPA. "I am very disappointed that the NFL and its hearing office didn't exercise better discretion and judgment in my case. I would like to sincerely thank the people who have been incredibly supportive of me during this challenging time, including my family, my agent, my union, my legal team, and the Cleveland Browns staff.”


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Minnesota Eternals
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 11:53 am

JosephO wrote:
So Josh Gordon suspension upheld. One year. And now Gordon will miss all of next year's training camp as well.

Fuck the NFL.

I think it should be "Fuck Josh Gordon for being such a stupid cunt". Rules aren't hard to follow Josh.


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Minnesota Eternals
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 11:54 am

Mohawk Ridge Marauders wrote:
Here's the statement that the moron released:

Quote :
“I'd like to apologize to my teammates, coaches, the Cleveland Browns organization and our fans," Gordon said in a statement through the NFLPA. "I am very disappointed that the NFL and its hearing office didn't exercise better discretion and judgment in my case. I would like to sincerely thank the people who have been incredibly supportive of me during this challenging time, including my family, my agent, my union, my legal team, and the Cleveland Browns staff.”

Is he fucking serious?

I hope this fucktard never plays again.


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Whiskey Creek Gadabouts
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 11:55 am

stinks for him/Browns fans that he misses next years' camp too.  So, the one year clock starts when the decision on the appeal comes down?  If so, that stinks and even more reason to be upset that this thing took so darn long to sort out.


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Mohawk Ridge Marauders
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 11:57 am

Yes and it's his own fault for continuing to fight it. The NFL had to wait for the arbitrator to render a verdict. It was nothing the NFL did. This is all Gordon's ass brained fault.

Also while all this bullshit was going on? He got A FUCKING DUI. He still hasn't been punished for THAT. He's absolute fucking waste.


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Minnesota Eternals
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 12:20 pm

Anyone putting any of this on anyone not named Josh Gordon is off their rocker. That statement he made is absolutely pathetic as fuck.


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Mohawk Ridge Marauders
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 12:22 pm

Want to really get pissed off Andy? Read all the people here shouting "Fuck Goodell" etc. etc. I'm having trouble focusing at work because of how fucking stupid these people are.

http://www.reddit.com/r/nfl/comments/2eqkux/mike_garafolo_on_twitter_breaking_sources_tell/


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Minnesota Eternals
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 1:03 pm

I just skimmed that and my viewpoint on human beings is that much more solidified...every lazy narcissistic fuck thinks they should be able to do whatever they want despite what is going on around them and then just blame others when it blows up in their face. It's double comical to see a Saints logo next to people saying this is bullshit seeing as that franchise has a title that should have been stripped.

There is a reaction for every action or SHOULD BE. I like when fuckhead idiots get punished. He chose to appeal which was a waste of everyones time and I love that that bites him for training camp next year. It should work that way.

Fuck Josh Gordon. His brain doesn't work.


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Chicago Crime Syndicate
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 1:36 pm

Enjoying the misfortune of others is pretty sadistic if you ask me. First of all, Gordon isn't missing training camp next year. He'll be able to join the team after this season. Secondly, Gordon failed the test, according to Rotoworld, but 0.01 nanograms. I think the reason a lot of people are upset over the ruling is because it is such an archaic response to such a meaningless incident. It gets people doubly upset when they see Ray Rice beat the shit out of a girl and get 2 games but he was 0.01 nanograms over the limit and gets busted for an entire year. I understand that the NFL has minimum sentencing penalties in place, but rules are meant to be broken and common sense really should have ruled the day. In any event, if the NFL doesn't change their rules/system after this, they are very much out of touch with reality.


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Las Vegas DeGenerates
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 1:38 pm

It's still mind blowing that this idiot gets a year suspension... But Ray Rice only got two games for attending the "Smack-a-Hoe" University!


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Minnesota Eternals
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 1:54 pm

What good is a rule if it isn't upheld?

I don't give a fuck what you think of a rule...debate that shit separately of an incident all you want. If the NFL changes its policy one day I won't care at all and can see why on this topic they might be better off for it.

@Jason...saying rules are there to be broken is a retarded statement through and through.

Comparing this to Ray Rice is a stupid argument. They have ZERO to do with each other.


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Minnesota Eternals
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 2:00 pm

Chicago Crime Syndicate wrote:
Enjoying the misfortune of others is pretty sadistic if you ask me.

I would prefer to be sadistic and believe in rules than to be in favor of stupidity and lack of consequences by one million percent.

I don't enjoy his misfortune half as much as I would enjoy him not existing as well as all the mouth breathers supporting him. The world wastes so much time on candyass fucks...it's gross.


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Morrison Minions
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 2:08 pm

I'm with Jason on this. The punishment needo to fit the crime. That is why it is compared to Rice.

Smoke pot 3 times =1 year suspension
Beat a woman half to death = 2 games.

If Rice was suspended a year then I don't think people would be saying much about the Josh Gordon situation.


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Mohawk Ridge Marauders
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 2:16 pm

Colorado Screaming Eagles wrote:
I'm with Jason on this. The punishment needo to fit the crime. That is why it is compared to Rice.

Smoke pot 3 times =1 year suspension
Beat a woman half to death = 2 games.

If Rice was suspended a year then I don't think people would be saying much about the Josh Gordon situation.

You're comparing a first offense to a repeat offender facing a minimum penalty. They're not comparable. I don't think you'll find a single person in the world that feels like smoking weed is worse than beating a woman but in this scenario the league did what they had to do with regards to Gordon. I think Rice should have seen more time but it is what it is.


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Morrison Minions
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 2:19 pm

That's the entire complaint. You don't see someone get 3 dui's and get life in prison while someone that commits murder has their drivers license revoked.


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England Dragons
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 2:23 pm

The two things have nothing to do with each other. I don't think anyone can honestly argue against Rice (or anyone) getting a tougher sentence for hitting a woman. He should have done. The NFL should amend their laws so a first offence which involves physical harm to another carries a harsher penalty.

But it currently doesn't so his punishment is correct to their laws.

Josh Gordon is an idiot who has repeatedly broken the same law / rule that is in place from the NFL. He got a two game ban for his first offence too. He just keeps doing it as he's an idiot. It doesn't matter that he only just failed the test. He failed the test. He knew if he failed another test, he would get a year ban. And he still took drugs. TWAT.

It doesn't matter if anyone thinks the NFL's rules are outdated. They were they rules when he failed yet another test. And he knew the risk he was taking and the punishment he would get if he failed another test.

I hope they change their rules tomorrow and make pot legal if that makes everyone happy. But Josh Gordon's 1 year ban should and will still apply as the rule was in place when he got caught. Again.



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Morrison Minions
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 2:59 pm

Trying to understand the other side of the argument...

Smoking pot is equally as bad as beating a woman unconscious because the NFL rules say so?

And they are unrelated because one player is on the Browns and the other player is on the Ravens?


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Mohawk Ridge Marauders
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:00 pm

Colorado Screaming Eagles wrote:
Trying to understand the other side of the argument...

Smoking pot is equally as bad as beating a woman unconscious because the NFL rules say so?

And they are unrelated because one player is on the Browns and the other player is on the Ravens?

Imma quit while I'm ahead.

cheers

troll


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New England Nineties
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:05 pm

Chicago Crime Syndicate wrote:
Enjoying the misfortune of others is pretty sadistic if you ask me.  First of all, Gordon isn't missing training camp next year.  He'll be able to join the team after this season.

Uhh, no. He'll be able to apply for reinstatement after this season. It's entirely up to Goodell whether or not to reinstate him. Tanard Jackson, I believe, was someone who was suspended indefinitely like Gordon, and he was out for two years because his first request to get reinstated was rejected. Gordon already has another DUI pending, along with continuing to surround himself with drug users (being in that car with someone who had pot). With a year off, isolated from the team, subject to up to 10 random drug/alcohol tests a month, I don't like this kid's chances.

Chicago Crime Syndicate wrote:

 Secondly, Gordon failed the test, according to Rotoworld, but 0.01 nanograms.  I think the reason a lot of people are upset over the ruling is because it is such an archaic response to such a meaningless incident.

:lmao:

People are upset because Gordon's a top 5 fantasy receiver and they have him on their roster or, even worse, head-scratchingly traded a 1st round pick for a guy who was suspended for the season and is clearly a clown already in Stage 3 of the substance abuse program.




Last edited by Adelaide Empire on Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:46 pm; edited 1 time in total
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New England Nineties
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:06 pm

And I agree that the rules are out-dated, over-zealous, and a little stupid. But I don't feel bad for anyone who agrees to those rules, and breaks them (several times over). Kinda like how some RW rules are a little over-zealous. I signed up for them. They're the rules.


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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:08 pm

Colorado Screaming Eagles wrote:
I'm with Jason on this. The punishment needo to fit the crime.

Actually, no, the punishment needed to fit the collectively bargained rules that everyone else in the league is subject to. Gordon isn't special because he's a great fantasy player.


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England Dragons
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:14 pm

Colorado Screaming Eagles wrote:
Trying to understand the other side of the argument...

Smoking pot is equally as bad as beating a woman unconscious because the NFL rules say so?

And they are unrelated because one player is on the Browns and the other player is on the Ravens?

No....

Smoking pot has nothing to do with beating a woman. The two crimes are not linked in any way except that two NFL players happen to have been recently punished for those crimes and people keep feeling the need to compare them.

The NFL have strict punishment in place for repeat offenders of substance abuse. Josh Gordon has failed multiple drug tests (I can't be arsed to check how many) and is in the NFL's set protocol once that happens. The punishment is the same no matter who the person is. Nothing to do with the Browns. Nothing to do with Josh Gordon. Nothing to do with anything. He's failed multiple drug tests and that carries set punishments each time he fails one. Same for everyone.

He's one of the most talented players in the NFL. And that is what makes this so frustrating. He is throwing it all away and denying everyone the chance to see him play. Because he can't stop smoking weed. Which, in my book, makes him a TWAT.

Ray Rice is a horrible human being for what he did. His punishment should have been more severe but I assume is in line with NFL policy. Which obviously needs changing. I'm not disputing this. My point is that this does not change anything about Josh Gordon and his ban. Which is correct as he is a multiple offender.

It has nothing to do with anyone's personal feelings about pot. It's stipulated by the governing body of his sport that these protocols are followed if you abuse substances repeatedly and he knew this when he continued to abuse.





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Chicago Crime Syndicate
 
 
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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:20 pm

@Andy- The world just isn't as black and white as you wish it was. There needs to be some common sense and every offense should be treated as a separate entity. Minimum sentencing is one of the many things wrong with the US justice system. The NFL should have the authority (and intelligence) to tell Mr. Gordon that he needs to knock this shit off, give him a 4 game suspension and force him to do 50 hours of community service tells kids not to smoke pot. At the same time, the NFL should also have the authority to tel Mr. Rice that knocking his girlfriend unconscious is never okay and should have given him a 1 year ban and forced him to go into anger management.

@Justin- Yes we are comparing a first offense to to a repeat offender and since the NFL handed down the ruling in each case, they are rightfully compared. As I've said in the past and Shawn said in this thread, each 'crime' needs to be considered on its own individual merit. I know you aren't going to tell me that a first time murderer should get off more lightly than a repeat drug offender, but yet that's the evidence that you are putting forth between Rice and Gordon.

@Jon- A felony battery charge is not in the NFL handbook. Just like committing arson is not in the NFL handbook. Why? Because those are things that you just aren't supposed to do and it's not possible to list every infraction a person can obtain in the handbook. So where did the NFL get the 2 game ban from? Because this was Rice's first time getting in trouble? That's the problem. The NFL had every right to match the penalty with the severity of the crime and failed to do so. Then they uphold Gordon's 1 year ban all because there is a pot smoking rule in the handbook? It just doesn't make any logical sense.

Colorado Screaming Eagles wrote:
Trying to understand the other side of the argument...

Smoking pot is equally as bad as beating a woman unconscious because the NFL rules say so?

And they are unrelated because one player is on the Browns and the other player is on the Ravens?

This is what I've been questioning for months but no one seems to be able to give a better answer than what's been said in this thread.


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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:39 pm

Chicago Crime Syndicate wrote:


@Jon-  A felony battery charge is not in the NFL handbook.  Just like committing arson is not in the NFL handbook.  Why?  Because those are things that you just aren't supposed to do and it's not possible to list every infraction a person can obtain in the handbook.  So where did the NFL get the 2 game ban from?  Because this was Rice's first time getting in trouble?  That's the problem.  The NFL had every right to match the penalty with the severity of the crime and failed to do so.  Then they uphold Gordon's 1 year ban all because there is a pot smoking rule in the handbook?  It just doesn't make any logical sense.


Completely agree with the first part. I'm not arguing that Rice's punishment is fair, I'm arguing about people saying Gordon's is unfair. I'd have had no problem with them banning Rice for a year for what he did. But that has nothing to do with Gordon as the punishment for his repeated failings are clear and documented. Same as Blackmon or Washington. Don't hear many people kicking off about them for some reason.


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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:45 pm

England Dragons wrote:
Chicago Crime Syndicate wrote:


@Jon-  A felony battery charge is not in the NFL handbook.  Just like committing arson is not in the NFL handbook.  Why?  Because those are things that you just aren't supposed to do and it's not possible to list every infraction a person can obtain in the handbook.  So where did the NFL get the 2 game ban from?  Because this was Rice's first time getting in trouble?  That's the problem.  The NFL had every right to match the penalty with the severity of the crime and failed to do so.  Then they uphold Gordon's 1 year ban all because there is a pot smoking rule in the handbook?  It just doesn't make any logical sense.


Completely agree with the first part. I'm not arguing that Rice's punishment is fair, I'm arguing about people saying Gordon's is unfair. I'd have had no problem with them banning Rice for a year for what he did. But that has nothing to do with Gordon as the punishment for his repeated failings are clear and documented. Same as Blackmon or Washington. Don't hear many people kicking off about them for some reason.

cheers

There's a direct relationship between fantasy viability and nerd rage.

I think Rice's suspension should've been longer. It just simply has nothing to do with Gordon other than hey, this doesn't look quite right. Rice's suspension was under the personal conduct policy, Gordon's under the substance abuse policy. Gordon is in the late stages of that policy. If we wanted to do a fair comparison for the purposes of fake moral outrage, we'd have to wait until Rice knocked his fiance out two more times. I guarantee you that if that were to happen, he'd be gone forever.


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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:45 pm

Chicago Crime Syndicate wrote:

Colorado Screaming Eagles wrote:
Trying to understand the other side of the argument...

Smoking pot is equally as bad as beating a woman unconscious because the NFL rules say so?

And they are unrelated because one player is on the Browns and the other player is on the Ravens?

This is what I've been questioning for months but no one seems to be able to give a better answer than what's been said in this thread.

Because there is a simple, correct answer that you refuse to accept, which is typical.


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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 3:47 pm

Chicago Crime Syndicate wrote:
Enjoying the misfortune of others is pretty sadistic if you ask me.

Someone getting hit by a car or cancer is misfortune. Failing a drug test because you did drugs and getting suspended by a drug abuse policy because you abused drugs is not misfortune.


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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 4:24 pm

Chicago Crime Syndicate wrote:
@Andy- The world just isn't as black and white as you wish it was.  There needs to be some common sense and every offense should be treated as a separate entity.  Minimum sentencing is one of the many things wrong with the US justice system.  The NFL should have the authority (and intelligence) to tell Mr. Gordon that he needs to knock this shit off, give him a 4 game suspension and force him to do 50 hours of community service tells kids not to smoke pot.  At the same time, the NFL should also have the authority to tel Mr. Rice that knocking his girlfriend unconscious is never okay and should have given him a 1 year ban and forced him to go into anger management.

The world is not how I wish it were. I would kill people for being fucking broken (breaking same rule 3 times). The NFL told him to knock it off more than once...why you think he should still be given benefit of the doubt?

I am not replying to Ray Rice anymore here as it has zero value to Josh Gordon to anyone who can think clearly.


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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 4:38 pm

Quote :
@Justin- Yes we are comparing a first offense to to a repeat offender and since the NFL handed down the ruling in each case, they are rightfully compared. As I've said in the past and Shawn said in this thread, each 'crime' needs to be considered on its own individual merit. I know you aren't going to tell me that a first time murderer should get off more lightly than a repeat drug offender, but yet that's the evidence that you are putting forth between Rice and Gordon.

The crime sure CAN elevate the punishment, but that does not create a direct relationship to compare. One had a STRICT guideline to follow, the other did not. Rice more than likely faces a much longer suspension if his victim does not testify for him.

Jason, on one hand you preach that the NFL should take things on a case by case basis (which they are doing with Rice) and not hard guideline (like Gordon). Yet you bitch and moan that Rice is only getting two games because the NFL considered all circumstances....which is it????


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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 4:43 pm

The lawyers (who get paid to fight) of Josh Gordon think they should sue the NFL (which just followed its agreed-to rules). lol 2

"My world" would be above this sort of horseshit.


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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:26 pm

Do you want to suspend Gordon for 1 year? fine, have fun. I have no sympathy for him for being an idiot. It was beyond moronic.

I have more of an issue with the Rice suspension. The Gordon suspension just solidifies how poorly the NFL is ran(run? I don't know, I'm not the smartest guy).

I think we are running into a problem where the world is losing it's values and common sense.

The message the NFL is sending to all of it's employees is a shame. "Beat those bitches senseless, but don't smoke pot!" That's sad.



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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:40 pm

Minnesota Eternals wrote:
The lawyers (who get paid to fight) of Josh Gordon think they should sue the NFL (which just followed its agreed-to rules).  lol 2

"My world" would be above this sort of horseshit.

Yes, this is already taking hold on some message boards where Gordon owners just can't come to grips with reality. Courts are very hesitant to interfere with collectively bargained agreements, which is why every Tom, Dick, and Harry that gets suspended doesn't end up in court. Everyone who buys this points to the StarCaps case, which was an entirely different situation. That was about the NFL not disclosing that StarCaps had a banned substance in it (something considered a steroid masking agent) despite knowing about it for years. The NFL ultimately won the case, but the players managed to get an injunction because they could show that they had a reasonable chance of winning their lawsuit (courts just don't hand out injunctions whenever a lawsuit is filed).

Gordon's argument seems to be "yeah I failed a drug test, but just barely." Good luck.

Also, I was wondering this the other day - I wonder how much money Gordon has to pay for all this lawyerin.'

He got a $2.3 million signing bonus, made $390k in 2012, and I think around $470k in 2013 when you take out his game checks for his suspension that year. So that's $3.16 million. A tidy sum to be sure, but he's now got a year off with no pay, a presumably expensive lawyer team, and obviously doesn't have the best head on his shoulders, so I'm wondering what he has left and what it would cost to bring a lawsuit that probably isn't going to accomplish anything.

Anyway, rapidly losing interest in this guy, maybe I'll check back in when his DUI gets to court.

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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:41 pm

Colorado Screaming Eagles wrote:
Do you want to suspend Gordon for 1 year? fine, have fun. I have no sympathy for him for being an idiot. It was beyond moronic.

I have more of an issue with the Rice suspension. The Gordon suspension just solidifies how poorly the NFL is ran(run? I don't know, I'm not the smartest guy).

I think we are running into a problem where the world is losing it's values and common sense.

The message the NFL is sending to all of it's employees is a shame. "Beat those bitches senseless, but don't smoke pot!" That's sad.


Again, I agree with you on these points:

1) The NFL substance abuse program is, for lack of a better term, silly.

2) The Ray Rice suspension was too short and does not send the right message.

I just don't think that #1 relates to #2 and we should be discussing #2 in the Ray Rice thread.


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PostSubject: Re: Josh Gordon WR CLE   Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:53 pm

Andy, move my posts to the ray rice thread cool2


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